pace21 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 03, 2020 2:03 pm
In simplistic terms I think the steeper the better.
... (lots of physio stuff) ...
Practically though gearing will be the limiter.
... (more physio stuff and some kind of formula) ...
In other words, carry speed but not so much that you "stall" into a wall and cut momentum by shifting into a smaller ring.
michaelcole wrote: ↑Wed Jun 03, 2020 1:00 pm
There must be a sweet spot for gradient. I scoped out a hill that I thought would be good but now I think its too steep for you to hold a good speed in terms of vertical ft/min.
Now I'm not sure what grade to target.
In simplistic terms I think the steeper the better.
We all have a certain amount kilojoules of energy that physiologically we can release in one minute. Depending on how fit you are (aerobic+anaerobic) the more kJ’s you’ll have. The larger the portion of that energy that goes to overcoming gravity, the better. The rest is lost to air and rolling resistance which aren’t helping you gain vertical. So steeper gradient will equal a lower “speed through the air” for a given vertical rate. Practically though gearing will be the limiter.
Also you can add to your physiological kJ’s by having kinetic energy stored at the base. Ie come into the climb with a high rate of speed because KE=0.5*m*v^2. And if you can gain that KE for free by rolling down an entry hill then that’s even better.
I agree with Pare here. Though I want to add that the amount of power that you can put out will depend on cadence, so if your hill is so steep that you are no longer able to hold your optimal cadence, then you will start to lose power. So I would say, the steeper the better until you hit a point were your cadence drops.
I would guess that for me the optimal cadence for a 1 minute all out effort would probably be around 100 and I don't think I would see any major power drop offs until I go below 80. That is just a guess on what I might see for myself, but something to consider when looking for an optimal hill.
djming wrote: ↑Wed Jun 03, 2020 12:38 pm
Two things from my attempt this morning:
1) Need to work on 1 minute uphill (and really 1 minute in general). Failed to hit 120 adjusted.
2) GPS drift messes things up (when I analyze my ride the GPS track has me off the regular road so the elevation readings for my selected section don't match if you actually plot that as a course).
GPS drift is one problem with this challenge and here are my thoughts on it.
1) Your change in elevation is probably not as far off as you might think.
2) I want this challenge to be fun! and attempting the challenge and not being able to submit it because of GPS drift is not fun. So I am going to ask that people be their own judge on GPS drift be their own judge. If your activity looks way off, then don't upload it, but most should be ok.
Looking at your activity Dave, I would say your drift is reasonable and you are good to submit. But incase you are waiting for a better result to submit I am including it so that everyone knows what I mean by reasonable.
I'm no rocket surgeon but it seems pretty obvious, go as fast as possible into the bottom of a really steep climb and then sprint until your eyes are popping out. Then keep going for another 30 seconds
JeremyC wrote: ↑Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:24 pm
I'm no rocket surgeon but it seems pretty obvious, go as fast as possible into the bottom of a really steep climb and then sprint until your eyes are popping out. Then keep going for another 30 seconds
Gave it a go tonight. Actually 2 go's. There was a bit of a learning curve for sure. Long story short I messed up my first attempt and for my second attempt I had a massive brain cramp. I hit my lap button 5 seconds before I started pedaling vigourously (and because I had to turn left onto the hill), and in my mind I figured "OK, just subtract that 5 seconds from the minute and everything will be square". So yup, stopped pedaling when the lap counter read 55 seconds. Oops, that's only 50 seconds of pedaling. So.... I need to go back. So it was a raw value of 135 feet, then +4 for being old, -10 for being a Cat 2 (Cratty guilted me out of the Pare clause, I think he really wants to win).
So I'm at 129 feet right now but I'm looking forward to seeing what happens when I pedal for 60 seconds.
Nice, Chris. And I also think if you include some more coefficients of rotational mass and the inverse relationship of inertial force including total rider weight against forces of gravity you'll really have this one in the bag! Or maybe you'll only pedal 45 seconds
My chain dropped in the first attempt. Almost busted a nut on the stem. Second attempt I had a biomechanical. I ran out of juice at about 50 seconds. 127 feet with a -5 for cat 3 handicap. LOL haven't raced road as a 3 in about 10 years. and 8 ft bonus for 50+
Tried again today. Definitely a nice improvement. The 1st hill (Cranbrook) I couldn't quite hold the power and I misjudged the wind. This one gives a real good running start so may try it again with a better warmup and/or more favorable wind.
2nd one (Moreland St) is a bit tricky to nail the entry with a left turn at lights but if you time it right can get some steam and then it goes right into 11-12%. Timed the entry perfectly to get the green left turn arrow and no vehicle in front of me. Power much better and if I could hit a 1 minute best could knock out a few more feet.
lap 4: https://www.strava.com/activities/3567993979/laps
I can't get my mouse to register a 1:00 time split on the hill, so select lap 4 then in the zoomed in profile start at 1:14:04 (678') to 1:15:04 (808') = 130' elevation change.
130 - 5 + 8 = 133.
Using Moreland St ("Moreland to Pine" segment, which I should have pushed just a bit more after the 1min was up to nab the KOM...)
djming wrote: ↑Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:17 pm
Tried again today. Definitely a nice improvement. The 1st hill (Cranbrook) I couldn't quite hold the power and I misjudged the wind. This one gives a real good running start so may try it again with a better warmup and/or more favorable wind.
2nd one (Moreland St) is a bit tricky to nail the entry with a left turn at lights but if you time it right can get some steam and then it goes right into 11-12%. Timed the entry perfectly to get the green left turn arrow and no vehicle in front of me. Power much better and if I could hit a 1 minute best could knock out a few more feet.
lap 4: https://www.strava.com/activities/3567993979/laps
I can't get my mouse to register a 1:00 time split on the hill, so select lap 4 then in the zoomed in profile start at 1:14:04 (678') to 1:15:04 (808') = 130' elevation change.
130 - 5 + 8 = 133.
Using Moreland St ("Moreland to Pine" segment, which I should have pushed just a bit more after the 1min was up to nab the KOM...)
For anyone struggling to get the mouse to highlight a 1 minute interval, I would suggest you get it close and then directly editing the last 2 numbers of the URL to be 60 apart.
remad wrote: ↑Sat Jun 06, 2020 3:26 pm
For anyone struggling to get the mouse to highlight a 1 minute interval, I would suggest you get it close and then directly editing the last 2 numbers of the URL to be 60 apart.
Damn cars. Had a good one going today on the other side of Moreland St (better wind direction today) when a car coming down the hill turned left into a driveway in front of me. They did see me last second and stopped but I had already cut all momentum so oh well. And wasn't going to go again.
And I was just getting to the steeper part so if I extrapolate out what I did for 38-40sec...
Agreed that the last 20 seconds are brutal and realized at that effort my hill (Menotomy) was only about 50 seconds lol, fortunately with a right and a left there was a little more climbing to be done
Ooops actually think it was maybe even a little better after playing with it a little more I think the best 1 min was 150ft(!?) - 6 = 144ft. Am I calculating correctly?
ajpiper wrote: ↑Sun Jun 07, 2020 4:50 pm
Ooops actually think it was maybe even a little better after playing with it a little more I think the best 1 min was 150ft(!?) - 6 = 144ft. Am I calculating correctly?
ajpiper wrote: ↑Sun Jun 07, 2020 4:50 pm
Ooops actually think it was maybe even a little better after playing with it a little more I think the best 1 min was 150ft(!?) - 6 = 144ft. Am I calculating correctly?